SAMIA: Hello, Salam, Shalom, Namaste, Sat Sri Akal, Aloha, Holah, Ciao, Bonjour, Buna and Privet!It's really really good to be with you again... And I know you will be really happy that you have joined us again because you have a very special guest and it's Barbara Benga who is a Money Mindset and Business Coach... And I'm so excited that you're joining us today Barbara… Welcome...

BARBARA: Hi Samia... thank you so much for having me here... Super excited to be here... Good evening from Barcelona…

SAMIA: Nice... Oh man... Okay so before we jump into the topic that we want to talk about that is all going to be related to the relationship between happiness and money... Can you tell us more about who you are and what you do…

BARBARA: Alright... so I am a licensed money mindset and business coach for female entrepreneurs... I was born in Estonia... And I've lived in quite a few countries... And so it has taken me a while to sort of get on the entrepreneurial path really because I had a very bad relationship with money... So when the pandemic hit in 2020 I realized that this is where people may need me because I was working on my own money story... Apart from that what else I do is I love perfume I love coffee and working out so when I have time...

SAMIA: Nice... That is so cool... oh man... Okay so the main topic that we want to focus on today is exploring the relationship between happiness and money …that's actually one of the most I would say like important topics I think that it's like so important for us to talk about and understand and think more deeply about... And so I'm like super happy that I'm able to do that with you right now and today... So tell me more... What's your perspective on the relationship between happiness and money…

BARBARA: That's a very good question... So I remember us discussing this and I asked you if you think that money can make you happy... And so we had quite a quite a nice chat there but what I do think that money in itself and I think most people agree and you agree that money in itself doesn't make you happy... The pursuit of money doesn't make you happy but it can surely make your life easier... But what really matters is your relationship with money... Because we can be happy with money or without money and it's really all in your mind in the end right...

SAMIA: Yes... I so agree with you on that because truly when you look at the essence of happiness the experience of happiness …it is an experience and it is in essence a state of mind and a state of heart... So it's an internal thing... Whereas money is like a concept it's something outside of us it's a tool that we utilize to help us get things that we want and desire …but you just said something very important I think that what our happiness really relates to or depends on in the context of money is our relationship with money... Can you tell me more about that… like what relationship do we have with money or can we have with money...

BARBARA: So we don't think about money as something to have a relationship with… but it's really having or not having money is one of the main areas of our life that determines the quality of our lives right... So it's important to think about how we think and feel about money... And I really want to mention where I got this from so it was from Ken Honda who's like a Finance Guru …a Money teacher from Japan and he was working with millionaires for years and years... And he figured out that there were millionaires who were like really happy and millionaires who were always unhappy and going for the next thing that would then make them happier... So he created this idea of money IQ which is managing money investing and all that and money EQ which is your like we said your relationship your emotional attachment to money... And it comes with a lot of unconscious limiting or non-limiting beliefs... So how your mind is programmed around the topic of money determines your relationship... And that's your level of happiness…

SAMIA: Oh I love that framing and I love that distinction between money IQ and money EQ... Wow... So tell me more about like what kind of skills or behaviors thoughts beliefs are we talking about when it comes to money IQ and then versus money EQ …so like maybe a few examples of each…

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BARBARA: Well the IQ and we don't even have to call it like this... It's just like our practical money management skills right... Do we know how to budget …are we saving …how much we are saving …are we investing do we have multiple bank accounts for specific purposes... And these days you know investing is crypto …investing in crypto has become very popular so that is part of the money IQ... And just a day to day money management and making your money grow is like the practical stuff... 

SAMIA: Yeah...

BARBARA: I don't know I was like I give a lot of information...

SAMIA: No no… that's awesome... And you know it's true... This is like a huge area a lot of people struggle with… especially a lot of women struggle with… especially I think from like cultures like mine... And right now I'm thinking of like my Indian Pakistani culture... And certainly the way it used to be traditionally and when I was growing up in India and Pakistan that was back in the 80s and 90s you know and my family was fairly traditional in our lifestyle... And so like I grew up with zero… almost zero learning about money EQ no... IQ- Money IQ...

BARBARA: Money Management...

SAMIA: Yeah... it was like money was always handled for me …it was always managed for me... And like there was no expectation that I would never have to or need to do it... As a girl as a woman …it was like I did it …if my dad wasn't and then you know I'd be handed over to my husband or if I didn't have a husband and my dad wasn't around I'd have brothers and uncles and other men in my life who would do all the money management... So like I was never taught or had any expectation to learn that... And so actually when I used to think about …even think about having to manage money having to earn money like if I thought about oh what would I do if I had to play the role my dad does in terms of being the moneymaker in our family it used to feel so difficult... And like I was like Oh I'm so glad I'm a girl and I don't have to do it because it's just so weird... It's hard …you know...

BARBARA: Yeah... yeah yeah yeah… I mean knowing how to manage your money and make money and grow your income is very very empowering... Not just for women but for everyone because you don't have to... So let's imagine you're one of those... Not you …but there's a person listening who is always just spending and so they find it hard to make ends meet at the end of the month and they're like wow where did all the money go… Which is quite common right...

SAMIA: Yeah. 

BARBARA: So imagine you have like a really good system so you never run out of money... And you feel so like strong like so powerful because you have money and you… it gives you security whatever it is for you personally...

SAMIA: That's right… And the security part is doing really important because I know it really impacted me because even though I wasn't the person in charge of managing money or you know earning money …the sense of security around having enough money was like a huge issue because actually what happened was that we had been living in a smaller town in India and my dad had his own business it was going fine …until riots broke out you know and like his factory got shut down like literally shut down for six months …he couldn't reopen his factory and things got so bad like at a financial level where my... I honestly don't remember much of this because I was like pretty young …I was younger than eight years old at that time but my mom tells us stories of you know like she would be like I'd get one egg and fry it as wide as I could so then I could cut it up into three pieces to give to me and my brother and my sister and she had nothing for my dad or herself you know… and that was if she if you were lucky to be able to get an egg you know so... And I remember going to school this is one memory I do have I remember going to school and my shoes had holes in them and my teacher was like you have to buy new shoes and you know I remember feeling and knowing like that I couldn't buy new shoes …we couldn't afford to get you new shoes you know and this was actually a memory that I had forgotten about until like a few years ago I was at a conference where we were working on money mindset and all of that and I actually was going through a process of self-hypnosis sort of process where you know I was guided and this memory was brought up into my consciousness... And I didn't even realize you know until that moment that Oh this was actually a real memory this was something that happened …it was still impacting the psychology you know all those decades later...

BARBARA: It does… That's the thing... I grew up poor too you know there were times when we just had some like bread and like a little bit of something in the fridge like jam maybe or a bit of cheese …and so my mother she was a single mother and she would just borrow money from people to put food on the table... And then she ended up like owing everyone money and that's another story right... What I wanted to say is that you kind of brought this topic up really nicely now... Our beliefs around money everything really but our topic as money now are sort of imprinted into our unconscious mind between the ages of zero to six or seven and it's like a program... It's like a computer program that actually runs your life... So what we do in money coaching what I do with my clients is we also clean …we clean up that mess …we like install a new program that will help you with more empowering beliefs...

SAMIA: Yeah that's so cool that's so cool... Because I mean man that can be life-changing you know that truly not can be… it is life-changing... Because ultimately again if you're talking about happiness as a state of mind and if you're currently unhappy or struggling with your happiness what's going to allow you to be happier …be more in control of your happiness is to change that underlying mindset...

BARBARA: Yeah yeah… You understand why you have this.. why you're unhappy around the topic of money you may need someone to help you like you did that guided meditation or you just write out your blocks or your beliefs and you start working on them and creating what we call a new financial identity because you can't create a happy life with an unhappy mindset right…

SAMIA: Yes... What are some other money mindsets that people have that are limiting…

BARBARA: Well I'm coaching a lot of entrepreneurs and I see that well first of all not deserving money... So they find it hard to charge or accept money or hit a consistent level of income... Another one is I have to work very hard to make money... Well yes...

SAMIA: That was me... I was like it's so hard to make money …I have to work hard to make money... Making money is a struggle …like that was so me …that was so me...

BARBARA: And let me guess what changed for you... I don't know I'm just taking a wild guess here is like once you started doing what makes you happy money came...

SAMIA: Right... Well not immediately not immediately because for a long time I was like Okay I'm gonna I'm just gonna do what makes me happy what I love to do but because I had all this like these limiting beliefs about how hard it was to make money... so I was like you know what I'm not even gonna try to make money doing what I love... I'm just gonna do what I love... And so I was a volunteer of the year …volunteer of …that was loved by every organization that I went into… like literally I won so many awards… like I literally won awards... where Samia is a volunteer of the year Samia... 

BARBARA: Oh wow  

SAMIA: ...the volunteer of the month...

BARBARA: Oh my... 

SAMIA: Yes because I would make a commitment to a particular cause …a particular organization... And then I would show up and I would like really show up and show up all the time... And do like things where literally to the point where the very first job I got I had been showing up and doing so much work with them they were like Samia you Why don't you just let us pay you to do all this work you're doing more work than some of our staff... And my first reaction if you can believe it or not I'm sure you can believe it... My first reaction was like no no no please don't worry about it you know I do this because I love to do this… I love to be here...

BARBARA: Yes... And if also like it we're serving …when you're serving people and you're helping people you absolutely cannot take money …it is another big limiting belief...

SAMIA: Yes yes… So you know for a long time this was like for good I would say I graduated from college in about 2007 so between 2007 and 2012 that was me …I was volunteering volunteering volunteering… And even when people offered me money I would like literally refuse to take money…

BARBARA: Oh wow... So you were actually like what we'd call blocking the flow of abundance because you were like just like so adamant about like not taking it... I just want to do what… you excluded doing what makes you happy and being paid for it like...

SAMIA: I didn't exclude doing what made me happy... I was doing what made me happy but I excluded the money...

BARBARA: Yeah that's what I mean... 

SAMIA: Yeah… 

BARBARA: ..sort of mutually excluded the two possibilities right...

SAMIA: Yeah exactly… Exactly... And for me the change started to happen in 2012 which was when I started my coaching business actually because that's when I started to work with my coach …my very first coach... And we began to do work on money mindset and beliefs and starting to you know like just bust through all these limiting beliefs... 

BARBARA: Oh yeah... 

SAMIA: And my happiness coach …she was like making money happiness coaching... And you know so she was like really my first model of someone who I saw …she was like extremely she is a person who's extremely spiritually grounded... She's so wise... I was just in total awe of her as you know the amazing person that she was and she was doing work that she loved and she was making money doing it... So being under her wing …getting mentored by her getting coached by her you know that is what really shifted me...

BARBARA: Wow! 

SAMIA: Yeah... 

BARBARA: Yeah... yeah... I mean everything comes in its own time right... So it's not like you should wait you should be wishing you'd met her before I think so I believe in divine timing... But another one now I think that came up is like being spiritual and having money are also often being mutually excluded...

SAMIA: Yes... yes... It's very much connected to that serving mindset right also because a lot of times the serving mindset is coming from that place of spirituality...

BARBARA: Well I come across this and in the coaching industry also because I work with a lot of spiritual women... And so what we need to do really is to flip the switch from… I cannot take money or I can't sell high ticket for example which is like two to three to five thousand okay in dollars... Sometimes charging those high prices actually is like a wake up call for the business owner …it's like okay I need to level up …I need to level up my game this is not a joke anymore... So I have to start serving my clients at the highest level so that I can pay my coach who is also serving at high… at her highest or his highest level... So what I think is also true is that the more commitment …the more energetic exchange the more… well... the higher the price is right and it totally makes sense if you think about it...

SAMIA: Yeah yeah… So how do you help these women who are spiritual and who have this perspective that you know they can't charge high prices like what is like a key like what is something that you might share with them to help them see that from a different perspective like what do you shift that belief to …what is a new belief that yeah... you help them create...

BARBARA: As a couple of things but so one block is around selling because we often have very negative experiences around selling or being sold to... So we don't want to be salesy and so we… it's easier for some reason to charge $10 instead of 100 or 200 instead of 2000 right… I don't know... I don't know why I mean I know why but you know what I mean... So it's easier to charge less even though you deserve more because you have put so much time energy and money into what you have created for your clients... Plus there is your life experience there's all the wisdom you have gathered there is your unique personality there is your beautiful feminine essence... So they're not just paying for information... There's so much that goes into your services as a coach who I mostly work with… and I'm sure it's true for retail businesses also they put their heart and soul into this so why shouldn't you ask for money right...

SAMIA: Yeah I mean there's for sure that aspect of deserving and there's also just the practicality of like what you need to keep the business running... And you know like I remember one of the big lessons I learned from my happiness coach… the first one who was my model for you know having that healthier relationship with money... So she charged about 200... like first of all she didn't do a lot of work where she charged by the hour… but when she did charge by the hour like she basically charged $250 an hour... and she said that was not and she helped me understand sort of like she was like this not just a random figure that I've come up with the you have to look at you know what are all the different expenses that you have because she was like you if you're going to do this work professionally you have certain things that you need... you need let's say a website that's of a certain quality you need to have an office setup that’s of a certain quality if you're wanting to see like patients in person or clients in person because at that time everything was pretty much being mostly done in person you know this is back in 2012... So you know you have to pay the rent and you know this and that... And so think about now …start to think about okay you have all of these fixed expenses and so how many clients you have to serve at what price point for you to be able to keep going with your business...

BARBARA: This is the money IQ you're giving me now...

SAMIA: Right 

BARBARA: ...and it's really it's a great example because it's practical the practical aspect of like...

SAMIA: yeah 

BARBARA: …running a business you have overheads and want to make profit...

SAMIA: Exactly but it totally but when she helped break things down for me in this way from the money IQ perspective it helped me see that it was not an issue of what …I mean it was not just an issue of what do I deserve …what do I think I'm worth …there is a very practical aspect of this that you have to take into account you know …and so it's like if you're charging... she was like if you're going to do …like use my business model of how I'm doing things and you charge anything less than 250 an hour you are not going to be able to sustain... Literally you know...

BARBARA: Yeah yeah yeah… 

SAMIA: So...

BARBARA: We have a lot of… and also like these days okay you don't pay for petrol most of the time but there's a lot of maintenance behind the scenes... And there's also well most business coaches and most coaches pay mentors also... So there's a whole network of VA's  …a whole network of people behind me offering you something... 

SAMIA: That's right...

BARBARA: Right...

SAMIA: That's right... As exactly exactly …like just recently last year I launched a new project... And I was like okay well what are the costs involved and you know my old self would not have taken into account all the time that I put in and all the time that my VA had to put in and all the time that other team members had to put in you know when I have taken that into account …but now I know better... So when we price things and we think about you know like how many clients do you need to reach out to and serve to break even and all that we take that into consideration when we decide on the price point at which we're going to be able to offer our service...

BARBARA: Yeah... that totally makes sense right... So sometimes there's quite a good deal of you know practicality involved also... But things get a little bit trickier when the prices go like really high right... So there's other factors coming in later on...

SAMIA: Yes.. for sure... Can you share one of those factors when the prices go beyond what is just practically needed?

BARBARA: So have you …I don't know if you notice in the coaching industry these days it's fashionable to make 10k... 10k months okay... So yes 10k in three months which is possible right away or 10k I don't know whatever number in one or whatever amount of time... So usually to get the result you pay your coach your mentor between like three and five …because there is a very high level of commitment involved from you and from the coach… but it's sort of like if I paid you let's say you promise me 10k in three months and you have a great strategy and mentoring system and resources and community and all that amazingness and then you charge me like 500 I would be like what... So I wouldn't give you the respect you deserve I wouldn't give you the dedication that it takes and I just wouldn't frankly get the results because the stakes are not high enough...

SAMIA: That is interesting... that is very interesting …yeah... Cool... So oh my gosh you just brought up some really awesome awesome points... and unfortunately we are sort of... 

BARBARA: Running out of time here... 

SAMIA: I know... so I'm like oh man I can't ask you a very deep question...

BARBARA: You can... you can...

SAMIA: But let's… Okay so from here where do we go next like any last thoughts any last bits of wisdom  that you would like to share with us for right now in terms of... okay so if someone just heard you say this and they're like oh my gosh a light bulb just went off in there in their mind what is the next step that they can take to move on from here... 

BARBARA: You mean to improve their money mindset...

SAMIA: Yeah... yeah... 

BARBARA: Start looking for patterns... do you always find yourself in the same situation and as saying the same things... 

SAMIA: Yeah 

BARBARA: ...like running out of money before the end of the month like getting a whole lot of money and then losing it like I don't know complaining about money …just look at your behavior and it will give you big clues of what needs to change for you to be happier around this topic... And then going back to happiness again right... Money is not everything and we are not making money for money's sake …it's a result of something bigger that we are doing in our life and with our lives... 

SAMIA: Yes… 

BARBARA: If we allow it if we allow it to come to us...

SAMIA: Yes... That is wonderful …so like a wonderful point at which for us to leave people thinking it's like what are you doing to block money coming into your life and what can you do to allow more money to come into your life... so like Barbara said look for those patterns …and you know the truth is that you when you begin to think and you try to look for those patterns you might find yourself struggling… you're like what patterns what am I doing I'm not blocking money from my life …I want money from my life... So you might struggle to actually identify these blocks these patterns and that's where Barbara can help you… so... 

BARBARA: Yay! Very happy... 

SAMIA: Yeah yeah… please check our show notes because we are going to be adding Barbra's links in there so you can connect with her and reach out for help and support... And I will also throw my links in there if you would like to get in touch with me... And yeah so until we connect next time I just want to thank you again Barbara for being with us today sharing so much amazing wisdom and experience with us …and I just want to thank all of you …our dear listeners for joining us and I just wish you lots and lots of peace and joy until we connect next time… :)