SAMIA: Hello, Salaam, Shalom, Namaste, Sat Sri Akal, Aloha, Holah, Ciao, Bonjour, Buna, and Privet! It's really, really good to be with you again. And guess what? We have a returning guest today, and our returning guest is Jacqy Stewart. And I'm so happy you're back with us, Jacqy. Welcome again… 

JACQY: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you... I am so grateful to be back and to be continuing this conversation.

SAMIA: Yes. And Jacqy, just for those people who might have missed our first episode… And by the way, if you missed our first episode, please go back, and listen to it. It was a fabulous episode. And my gosh, we talked about so many really important things. And among them, we talked about what you need to create change... And we started to dig into, you know, the conscious and the unconscious, and connecting with our souls and getting to that soul truth… because Jacqy is a Soul Truth Illuminator and Quantum Guide… But before I say anything more… Jacqy, please just give us a short/brief reminder of who you are and what you do…

JACQY: So… thank you for having me, again... I am passionate about guiding people back into themselves. So many of us get lost in the expectations of everyone else around us and who we think we need to be, and based on our society, our culture, our family, our experiences… And somewhere along the lines, we lose complete touch with who we really are, and those parts of us that bring us joy, and the things that our soul needs for us to really live a life that's thriving. So I work with clients to guide them to those deep parts inside of them that they forgotten are there. And we start to unravel the onion that is you, to start to reveal the real, true essence of who you are, what makes you unique, and how you can start living a more authentic life, right. We throw around this word about… authenticity… all the time, right. Everyone wants to be more authentic, but nobody knows how... And they think they're showing up authentically with still a bit of a flavor of what they think other people need.

SAMIA: Yeah.

JACQY: So how do we get back to that place where we can really drop our need to please everyone else around us? Be okay with who we are right now in this moment... and show up in our worlds in a way that brings us joy?

SAMIA: Yes, and I love that. I love that... I think one of the amazing bits of wisdom that you shared with us in the last episode where when we were wrapping up was, you know, this idea of... Yes, you know, the journey of going back to us… But in that context, one of the insights that you shared was to... this idea of following our feelings… like, you said something to the effect of, you know… if something feels off for you, then it is off... And that actually triggered a whole bunch of questions in my mind and I would love to follow up with you more deeply on that… because I do agree with you about our feelings being a really powerful guide for us... And I also know that a lot of us in our quest to follow our feelings can find ourselves confused and where our feelings are actually leading us. And yeah, because it's not always so easy for us to figure our feelings out. But also like sometimes it feels like we're feeling contradictory feelings... And sometimes it's also like a challenge around feelings versus action versus just, you know, like bringing different parts of us into alignment. And there's just like, all kinds of stuff, you know, that can come up as obstacles in our quest to really, truly follow our feelings. And so I would love to dig in with you what some these challenges are and how we can resolve them. And maybe, you know, I'm thinking one thing that might be helpful in this context is… I've heard you do some brilliant teaching around this idea of our having three minds and four bodies… and in the way that you teach about it, and, you know… I think we can get to a lot more clarity about how do we really follow our feelings…

JACQY: Right…

SAMIA: ..and what that means. Yeah.

JACQY: So the first thing in that is our emotions are signposts... that's it, that's all. We... an emotion doesn't actually last more than 90 seconds unless we choose to stay in that emotion. So when we start to recognize that our emotions are simply messengers, our job is to get the information from the messenger, and then the emotion can go. It doesn't have to stay anymore. And this goes for what we would deem to be positive emotions or negative emotions, right. And so within all of this… let me backtrack slightly and give the context for it... We talked about having three minds and four bodies… the four bodies that we have: our spiritual body, our mental body, our emotional body, and then our physical body. And information comes down to us via these different parts of our body. So we can actually look at it as... like your aura… if you know… there's a big bubble around you, right. And the spiritual body is sort of the outer layer, and then the mental body is the next layer. And then the emotional body is the layer after that, and then we connect with our physical body... So we actually store information from our brain, or what we deemed to be our brain, inside our actual physical brain, in different parts of our body and outside our body, right... And that is done through our three different minds. So we have our conscious mind, which is our thinki-thinki mind. This part is connected to our emotional or our mental body. So conscious mind, mental body... It's the part of us that likes to think about things, analyze things, rationalize things, make things logical, where we need to understand what is going on. So that's the connection there. Then we have our unconscious mind. And our unconscious mind is where we actually store 95% of the information that we have. It is where our thoughts are, our beliefs are, our long-term memories, our values, our morals… it is where our decision-making comes from, right. All of that happens in your unconscious mind. So all of our habits, behaviors, how we react to things, all of that stored in the unconscious mind... And it is directly connected to our emotional body. So we experience our emotions unconsciously which creates a situation that brings it into our conscious awareness. And then we can label it and go… I feel angry, I feel sad, I feel hurt, I feel happy, I feel joyful… whatever it happens to be. The third mind that we have is our spiritual mind. People will call it your soul, your higher self. And this is connected to our spiritual body. So the thing that we need to understand is that our conscious mind is the only part of us that thinks in language, whatever language it is we happen to speak. Our unconscious mind… and for the sake of this conversation, I'm gonna use the term higher self… Higher Self/soul... It… both of those only process things in terms of symbols, colors, pictures… it doesn't have that same logical... I need to put a sentence together that makes grammatical sense… that's my conscious mind. So our unconscious mind and higher self communicate with our conscious mind via symbols and pictures and emotions. The emotion comes up to indicate that something is right for us, or something is off... So for example, anger... anger almost always is an indicator that you have a boundary you're either aware of or unaware of that has been broken. And the response to somebody else disrespecting this boundary is you get angry about it.

SAMIA: Right. Yup.

JACQY: So, instead of stepping back and going, "Okay, I'm experiencing anger in this moment… what is it that has caused me to get angry?" Well, so and so did this, that, and the other thing, right... They called me in the middle of the night, they didn't listen to me when I said I was going to be busy. They showed up at my house… this happens to people in their parents all the time, right. My mom just keeps showing up, whatever she feels like. And I told her, she needs to call first. And now she's showing up again. And now I'm angry... Right? Well, the anger is saying to you, your boundary has been broken, you need to do something differently to honor your boundary.

SAMIA: Yeah... Yeah… Are you going to say something else? Because every time you're speaking, you just made me think of more questions…

JACQY: Go ahead. What are your questions thus far?

SAMIA: Okay… So the question or rather… I guess it's more of a share, but there might be a question in there... So the example of the anger being an indication that a boundary has been violated… I am 100%, with you on that. And one thing that I have been sort of realizing in the context of experiencing anger because boundaries have been violated, is that… yes, my boundaries have been violated when I feel angry. And sometimes, I don't just... like, the proper response in terms of getting back to a place of peace, and especially if it's a relational issue, it's not always so much… it's not always about “I need to enforce my boundaries”. Sometimes, I need to re-evaluate my boundary, because... And I think this is sort of, like, I guess, where the potential complication can come in, in terms of me trying to follow my feelings to, you know, live the most awesomest life that I can because… you know, like, Yes, I will feel angry when a boundary has been broken and so then if I have this awareness that I'm like… Okay, well, boundary has been broken. And then the next logical thought or idea that might come to my mind is, well, I need to enforce my boundaries. But what if the boundary that I have is not an appropriate boundary and needs to be changed, right… so then, how do I figure that out? Do you have any insight on that?

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JACQY: Yeah. Okay... So first of all, I mean, we could do a whole episode on boundaries. And I'm not going to go into the ins and outs of those at the moment... But what I am going to tell you is you're exactly right. A boundary I had two years ago, may not be the same boundary I need today, right... When I'm getting out of toxicity, sometimes we do need to put up walls and it's a straight-up "Yes/No." There's no flexibility in it... I will tell you though, that with… the more you dive into setting boundaries, boundaries are not walls. Often people will put up walls around them, they'll be cement walls that are dug six feet in and cemented up around them. And it doesn't provide any opportunity for flexibility and then we get stuck again in our box.

SAMIA: Yes…

JACQY: We are building boxes around us in an attempt to keep ourselves safe, but it doesn't allow people to maneuver in and out of our box, you know, to allow people into our space and out of our space.

SAMIA: Yeah…

JACQY: So really, the first thing to do is to go... is to ask yourself, right… So we need to step back before we run off with the anger and react, right, and become reactive, and blow it up, and get explosive, and all those things… The first thing you need to do is step back and breathe, right… Like, stop the emotion in that moment and bring yourself back to you... So it may be saying to someone, I need a moment. And taking that moment and walking away… taking a couple really deep breaths into your body. And one of the things I teach… if people are interested they can find the information… but I do… there's a 4-6-8 breathing pattern that will actually lower the stress responses in your body instantly if you do it three times, right… So using… finding what works for you there, what's your calming technique to bring yourself back… Because when you're in a heightened state of emotion, you can't actually see anything outside of that. When they say “you see red”, it's… that's a real thing, right… all you see is red… you cannot actually see solution when you're in problem.

SAMIA: Right.

JACQY: And when you're in your emotion, you can't see outside your emotion. So the first thing we need to do always is neutralize the emotion. And get ourselves back to a neutral state... Once I'm in a neutral state, I can then do the reflection, right… which is asking myself those questions... What is it about this situation that really upset me? What need do I have that is not being met, right? Because you know, relationships are symbiotic. We actually can't learn outside of relationships, we need these relationships in our lives in order for us to learn and grow.

SAMIA: Yeah.

JACQY: And sometimes what someone else is doing is actually and almost always telling you something about you.

SAMIA: Yeah.

JACQY: And so, once we get that information, right... So I need attention that this person isn't giving me. I need respect that this person isn't giving me... Then we can go, you know, at that point, we can say… Okay, this boundary that I have set up, is it still serving me? Is that really what I need? Or can I sit down with this person and can we negotiate something that works for both of us, and find the win-win-win in it. Because it's not always... We get so caught up in labeling everything as right or wrong, or good or bad, or it's got to be this way or that way. When really, if we can get ourselves into a mindset of limitless possibilities, then we can come up with the most creative ways to figure out a win-win-win situation for ourselves where our needs are met, and for others where their needs are met as well. And that's ultimately the ideal…

SAMIA: Yes. Oh, I love that. Oh, I love win-win-win…

JACQY: Yes. In any way that we can… because, you know, it all starts with us and we choose how we are going to act or behave. And yes, it is based on unconscious programming. Yes, sometimes it does not feel like a choice, right… And to let people off the hook… are going to turn around and say, you know, well, I'm depressed and I'm not choosing that... It's based on the choices you've made. And I always let my clients off the hook and my students off the hook by telling them… we don't blow up our lives consciously, ever. And I am, I'm there with it, right. Having come out of something… I didn't consciously go into it and go, Okay, I'm just gonna, you know, completely withdraw from my life and go back into a depressive state because that sounds like fun for the next two and a half months. Right? These things happen because there's something we need to learn… There's something that we missed, whatever it is… It's when are we going to make the choice to do things differently, and with the acceptance and giving ourselves grace that we're never going to do it perfectly. 

SAMIA: Hmm… Yes. Yes… I… Oh, yes. And this, this, this expectation of perfection, my God… I think that is such a… it is such a… I mean, that expectation creates so many challenges in our lives. I mean, why do we even have this expectation? It's like, how in the world… I mean, I guess it's that part of us that… the higher self that comes from source, from creator that is perfect, that wants to go back into that… melt back into that state of perfection… maybe it's that, that desire that makes us want to be perfect in the context of our life in this world as well… but, like truly, I mean, the way this world is and the way that we are with all the limitations that we have, you know, just because of… we’re human… it's like, perfection is not even possible, is it? You know…

JACQY: So circling back, right… perfection is again, a box we step into. And it's based on our experiences and what we deemed to be perfect. So often, it's that comparison to other people… we will label them as perfect and go, now I've got the expectation that I need to be just like them. And if I'm just like them, then everything will be okay. Because their life is wonderful, right… And the perfection also comes from how did we receive attention and affection when we were kids, right? Did we get praised and valued when we did things really well, right... And I know people who were raised and they were… they come home with a test and they got 95%. And the parent says to them, well, what happened to the other 5%? So instead of celebrating…what went wrong… there was this constant need to please and to do better and to do better and to do better, right. And yet, my question would be, what even is the definition of perfect? In what context…

SAMIA: Yes.

JACQY: …are you even looking at being perfect? And what is your definition of perfect? Because a lot of people don't even know what it is that they're striving for... Perfectionism is this abstract concept…

SAMIA: Yes…

JACQY: …that we form in our mind. But we don't actually really know what it is. Because if we did, we would have goals that would move us there. It's… to reframe it for people… and especially if you are someone who, you know, is always striving to get everything right… because the thing is, there is no right or wrong... There are different ways and different flavors and/of how we can do things. It's what are we doing every day to become a better version or a more perfect version of ourselves... In my journey, and I am a recovering perfectionist… In my journey, I've had to learn that every day I am going to be the best imperfectly perfect version of me. Because me showing up in my imperfections is me showing up in my authenticity. And that is my definition of perfection, right… And that perfection is always evolving. So what… what makes me great today is not necessarily what's going to make me great tomorrow. And that stepping outside of that box …that's blowing that box up and going, no, I'm not striving for perfection. I'm just striving to be a better, more joyful, more loving, more connected version of me every day.

SAMIA: Yes, you know, I really appreciate that idea of thinking about perfection... if you're going to think about or strive for perfection, to think about it in that context. Because, I think where perfection, the idea of perfection, can become really problematic is when we think about perfection, in any context, as… there is only one way of being or doing something. And then you're always trying to do things that way or maintain that one way... And I think we were talking about this maybe in the last episode, I can't remember, or was it just earlier today… my memories are all getting mixed up... But, you know, this idea that we need to be constantly growing. I mean, that's just one of the laws of this universe, that everything's in a state of constant movement, change, and growth, really. If you're not growing, you're dying... And so when you have an idea of perfection as something that resists change, or that doesn't allow for change... you're really going against the very nature of how the universe works, the very laws of how the universe works… and how can that create fun and ease in your life? It's bound to create more difficulty and problems in your life…

JACQY: And you brought up a really, a really interesting concept, right… Which is the fact that the more we dive into learning the universal laws, right… I mean, we can look at nature... nature is constantly in a state of change. No two trees out there are the same. No two plants out there are the same. They go through similar cycles though, which is, I mean, right now it's winter, and I'm in southern Ontario, Canada, and you know, our trees are bare. And each one of them, you know, goes into this state of reflection and renewal, and come spring will start to pop out buds again. And again, there are no two trees out there, that bark is exactly the same, or their leaves are exactly the same color, in the exact same spaces... It's, you know, and we don't sit there and judge the tree and go, "Well, why aren't you the same way you are? And you're not perfect, one of your branches is crooked and lying downwards." No, we see the beauty in that, right. And, and yet we seem to think as human beings that I need to be perfect… in comparison to what? Right... And when we start to look at it like that, you are... and I want to remind everyone, you are perfectly perfect just the way you are. Because you are! Because you're a soul... On the face of this planet, in this universe, you came down exactly the way that you needed to come down in order for you to learn the lessons you're meant to learn in this lifetime. And it's that simple. It's… are we leaning into what we're learning? And are we continually evolving? No perfectionism required. Because the moment you think you need to do it perfectly... and I am, you know, fell victim to this in terms of learning how to be spiritual… and you learn… you know, my mentor would say to me… okay, here's the steps you need to take. Here, you need to set up an altar, you need to sit down with your altar, you need to keep this journal, you need to write... And I got bogged down in all the how-tos of doing it, right. And then I just abandoned ship and went, this is all too much. And what I learned was… a spiritual practice, for instance, the way I practice my spirituality is different from the way you practice your spirituality, which is different from various mentors I have and friends… Again, it comes back to… how do you need to do you... And what resonates with me and what I need in the morning first thing in order to start myself off on the right foot for the day, is different from what someone else does. So we have this… yes, we want to start by modeling people who have taken those steps before us. And you know, I will share with my clients, this is what I do in the morning. And then I add to that, and I have friends who do these things. And so what I want you to do is, I want you to take this experience and try it on... And see…

SAMIA: Yeah…

JACQY: ...what parts of that… so you know, you start a gratitude practice... I mean, everybody on the face of the planet, if you're in any form of spiritual development or personal development, has heard… the first step is to practice gratitude. Okay, well, how do I practice gratitude? Some people will just sit with it in their hearts and feel into that feeling and think about the things they were grateful for. Other people tell you, you have to write it down. Some people will tell you, you need to do it first thing every morning, someone else will tell you, you need to do it every night. I'm going to tell you that you need to play with all of those and figure out what, one, works best into your life and your rhythm. Two, what fills you up and resonates with you the most. I like to do my gratitude in the morning. It just simply gets me focused on being grateful. At the end of my day, I… that with writing out a list of all of the things that went well for me that day. There's an element of gratitude in it. There's an element of celebration in it.

SAMIA: Yeah.

JACQY: Right… Those make me feel good. Those light me up... And so that's how I practice it. But again, we're blowing up the box of how one practices gratitude and if you're a grateful person, you do this. No, if you're a grateful person, you do it the way that feels good to you…

SAMIA: And I think what you just said I... Oh, my gosh, I love you so much... I would just like to highlight for people that idea of… “needs to feel good” because I think what I'm totally… I have this perfectionist streak in me that comes out, sometimes at very inconvenient times, in terms of becoming a hindrance in my process of growth and so forth... and I think what I have realized is that, in my quest to be perfect, when this perfectionist streak comes out, what happens is that I will get so focused, for example, on the physical aspect of how I need to do something, that I disconnect from the feeling aspect. And, you know, this is why I thought it was so helpful and wonderful when… when you reminded us about the fact that we have three minds, and we have these four bodies, you know, like, because if I'm just focusing on my physical body, and how my physical body is engaging in these practices of gratitude, for example, in the context of writing things down, and like, if I get overly focused on writing it down just right, writing the right number of things down, writing it down on the right piece of paper with the perfect pen, and you know… Like, these are all things that I've gotten obsessed with that then, you know, I can so easily lose experiencing this process at the emotional level, at the mental level, at the spiritual level. And, and then it… and then it doesn't have the impact that I desire, it doesn't benefit me as much as it can, or as much as I want to even experience it, because I've just restricted it to enacting at one level and disconnecting from the other levels.

JACQY: So there's a great question that I like to ask myself or ask my clients, right… And that question is, for what intention and purpose am I doing this… Because so many of us become disassociated from ourselves, and, and most of us that are experiencing problems, anxiety, depression, all of those things... it's because we're out of rapport with ourselves. And so… and we're so dissociated from ourselves, that we don't even know what joy feels like anymore in our bodies.

SAMIA: Yeah…

JACQY: And so when we get into this perfectionist state, we actually enter into a stress state.

SAMIA: Ah, yes…

JACQY: And when we're in a stress state, that's where we get this narrow vision, and we can't see outside of it. So when we're… when we start to get to go down that rabbit hole of… this needs to be perfect. I can't do this yet, because, you know, it's not perfect, and I've got to do this, this and this before I can put this out into the world… or whatever it is you're attempting to do… it's… it's coming back to you and going… for what intention and purpose am I doing this? And what do I want to experience while I do it?

SAMIA: Yeah…

JACQY: How do I want this to come? Because if we're creating something, say that we're putting out into the world, and we're in a highly stressed state while we're doing it, well, guess what energy it's going out with? So it's not going to land the way you want it to land anyways. Because it's like, you just sprinkled it with all this crap, which is your stress and anxiety and all of that around it, and you sent that out into the universe under that frequency. And then you sit here and go, why is no one signing up for my programs? Why is no one responded to my post? Why is no one… Because energetically nobody wants anything to do with it, right… Because people feel energy, even if they don't know they feel energy, right… And so it's really in those moments, stopping and asking yourself… Why do I feel the need to be perfect? What would happen if I sent this out imperfectly? Or, how is this actually a problem for me? Because like we talked about before… what we're identifying on that surface level, there's something deeper that's going on underneath it. And perfectionism is directly linked to fear of rejection. If I'm not perfect, they won't love me. If I don't do this perfectly, they will judge me. Well, I'm going to tell you right now, pretty much the only person judging you is you. Really, what do you care about the haters out there who aren't even your people?

SAMIA: Yeah, Yeah… like, even if other people are judging you, it's like, if you're not judging yourself, other people's judgments won't bother you.

JACQY: And here's the thing… And this is, you know… and like I said, I've been through a lot of shifting and growing in my world lately… We are our own worst critics. I will say things to myself in my head that I would never dream of saying out loud to another human being. And most of it is crap I made up.

SAMIA: Yes.

JACQY: …right… running these stories in our heads based on all of our fears of what's the worst case scenario… and then we wonder why the worst case scenario shows up… Because we funneled a lot energy into creating that story in our head, right… So there's a very quick, and I'm going to share this here… there's a very quick technique that I teach my clients about really getting a grasp on what is the story we're telling ourselves, right… So... the technique is, is… if you close your eyes for a minute, and you breathe into your body, and then I want you to float out into the future 15 minutes after the successful completion of whatever it was that you were worried about. And really be in that moment, be in that moment of… how do you feel when it all went exactly the way that it needed to go, and everything worked out even better than you could have even anticipated having it work out… And everyone is raving fans, and you're getting praised left, right and center because everything went perfectly well, right… And you sit in that moment until you can envision that event, that you were previously worried about, in all of its success. Now, what happens when you do that… and you just experienced it… so what happens as you start to envision the successful completion?

SAMIA: I feel so much joy and excitement and just positive energy flowing through me.

JACQY: You can't actually experience anxiety if you're focused on the successful completion. So if at any point during that exercise, you're like, I'm still feeling anxious, then you're still focused on some fear. I used this technique when I was training to become a Neuro Linguistic Programming or NLP trainer. And we, you know, had to do these presentations and run these segments and all of that. So before I would get up to do my training, I would literally run this protocol, right… And you envision everything going… I remember everything I need to say, everything comes out of me authentically, all of those things, people telling me how fabulous it was, and getting all the positive feedback, and this and that. And then all the worries, the stage fright that I had been experiencing prior, were gone. The other thing that goes along with this is understanding that adrenaline is a real thing. Adrenaline doesn't mean run the other way, right. Right before you're about to do something new we all experience adrenaline. You know professional athletes, the only difference between them and us is that they know and recognize that that basically means it's game time. And they know how to move the adrenaline in their bodies...

SAMIA: Yes.

JACQY: …so that they can use it rather than have it dragg them down.

SAMIA: Right. Right.

JACQY: And so the other thing I used to do before I would get up… because you know you would… you start to shake… and so many of us go, well, that means I shouldn't do this. No, it doesn't. That means you need to step in. It's game time.

SAMIA: Yeah.

JACQY: Go and do 20 jumping jacks, move the energy in your body. Because remember, your emotions are part of one of your bodies. And when you're feeling big emotions, you got to move the energy. This is why when we get angry, we probably do the best cleaning we ever do. Because we're moving that energy and it helps us to feel better because we're getting it out of our bodies.

SAMIA: Yes. Yes. Oh, I love that. I love that. Jacqy, you are doing it to me again... I am having so many more questions coming up in my mind to ask you, and we're running out of time again.

JACQY: It’s all good. It’s all good…

SAMIA: Oh gosh. Do you have any wrap up thoughts for now?

JACQY: Yes… If you are out there feeling lost or stuck or depressed or anxious, what I want you to remember is that all that has happened is you have broken rapport with yourself. You've forgotten who you really are. And you've forgotten that there are different parts of you that exist outside of your thinky-thinky, rational, ego brain. And the first step to rebuilding that rapport is going and finding somebody who can guide you back into yourself, who can start to rebuild that relationship between your three minds and get them working together for you. So you can start to see all of the choices, all of the opportunities, all of the possibilities that are out there for you, that you can't see when you're stuck in a place of fear. And, you know, the more that we step into really getting to know ourselves and building a relationship with ourselves, the easier life becomes to navigate.

SAMIA: Thank you for that. Thank you for that Jacqy. And as my last reminder to our listeners, I will just say again… please make sure you check the show notes because we will be dropping Jacqy's links there so you can connect with her and get some help and support to reconnect with your true self. And yeah, do it whenever you feel called to do it, whenever you feel ready to do it. And until we connect next time, I just wish you lots and lots of peace and joy… :)